No, lol. Down with all CEOs 🏴🚩

I thought roommate just meant housemate, not sharing a literal room

Welcome to

This time next year.

Against, but I’m more against debating it, especially in anarchist spaces. As of writing this it hasn’t exploded into arguments here, but debates on electoralism have a habit of reactivating liberal tendencies, in particular the notion that the system has a chance of saving you, and the emotional baggage that liberalism drills into our heads about how the current election is the most important thing ever and you’re a monster for not giving the system your time and attention.

Every New Years Eve, I spend about 15 minutes watching network television with my parents while the Times Square ball drops, and I literally ask them every time “how the fuck do you live like this?”

You gotta be some deep turbo shitlib to take offense with this post.

Lots of people who aren’t as sensitive as we are to capitalist propaganda (advertising) being constantly flung into our faces 🤮

Nah I was asking that specific person. There are definitely anarcho-curious people on .world, but the person I’m replying to…like I just have to ask them, why are they here? Why not go to a community they actually vibe with?

💯

I mean I am radical leftist tho 🏴

Thanks for clarifying 😆. And maybe don’t pay attention to the software my instance is currently running 😅

then y r u here

Okay I get that you’re dunking on Rimu yelling about a Zionist getting banished to the Shadow Realm with the help of a LLM, but what’s the significance of the Maori guy?

Collective action does not require, and in my view is not even helped by, the existence of the State. Defying the government is (insufficient and) unnecessary to push off the water crisis to the future, e.g. the government can physically import water from elsewhere (although I wouldn’t bet on it), but defying the government is necessary (but insufficient) to permanently (on human time scales) solve the water crisis there, precisely because the State is designed to prevent the people from solving their own problems when it conflicts with capitalists’ interests.

But they require a significant investment of capital, engineering skill, and long-term management.

We can and should do this without the tyranny of the State. I’m not a water treatment engineer, but I am an engineer, and I don’t need nor want a cop or similar authoritarian and hierarchical structure breathing down my neck to organize complex technological systems with the continuous consent of the community.

The right thing to do is take direct action: one person beats the tar out of the bus driver, other person pulls the handbrake or hits the brake pedal. The bus has far too much inertia for even all the passengers to materially affect where it’s going. Liberalism demands that you override your survival instincts to do meaningless performative bullshit so you can smash into a tree on their terms.

And I honestly cannot believe that anyone would think anything other than direct action is the right option in this scenario. I mean this in the nicest way possible…how could you possibly think that rearranging the passengers could even be a realistic way to avoid a tree, or anything at all, in any situation? It doesn’t comport with physics. It’s completely unintuitive, and it’s not one of those counterintuitive things that makes sense under closer scrutiny. It doesn’t even begin to fix the actual problem. And even if you could affect the trajectory for a moment, the bus driver can just countersteer a few degrees.

Like if you actually did this in real life, you would just end up with a bus full of bodies all crammed together on one side wrapped around a tree.

Like honestly, not trying to be mean but I literally cannot explain this in any other way: this is how it actually feels to talk to liberals about their views. It’s literally “you’re on a bus being driven by a madman into a tree, here’s why you’re a monster for saying ‘we should physically directly try to stop him’”. Liberal electoralism doesn’t even give sensible solutions in the best of times, it’s against all physical and empirical evidence, but liberalism still manages to bring people, who are rightfully desperate for collective action and a sense of belonging, into doing harmless nonsense, anything for a whiff of the hopium that the monsters in the DNC peddle to us.

By refusing to try to make things better within the system as well as outside of it, you’re hamstringing your own movement.

Yes, this is why we need to make things better outside the system! I’m not even remotely saying to do nothing or let the capitalists win. I’m saying, aim for more than simply trying to win at liberal democracy.

The State is an enemy of the people. You cannot reform a system that is inherently designed to oppress the people.

The system as it is now, with whomever getting the most votes wins, means that the less people voting, the more influential the remaining votes are. If only three people voted in an election, reach vote has 33% of the decision making power.

Again, that “democracy” is decoration over what the people who control the system actually want to do to us. As the proletariat, our class does not get to materially affect the trajectory of the bourgeois system. The whole thing is structured to impose this reality upon us. Liberal democracy is a pressure valve to make sure proletarian revolution never happens. It decreases our ability to affect the trajectory of the system by focusing all our anger and effort towards harmless, nonsensical political theater.

I guaran-fucking-tee you, if the system somehow managed to register a vote to democratically take the capitalists out of power, or even just make their lives harder enough, it would get couped in like three seconds and replaced with competent fascists.

By becoming an awkward adult

Yeah you do. Sorry, I don’t make the rules 🤷

I’m not sure why you think it’s a bad thing to vote.

Because we should simply refuse to participate in an inherently genocidal system. Reject the notion that it even remotely represents us.

If it was such a great idea, why is the right trying to make it harder for people?

Because capital has factions. The right wing of capital wants to make it harder for the left wing of capital to get their way. The leftist view is: reject capital in all its forms. Leftists are not literally right-contrarians, i.e. do what the right tells us they don’t want. This would make leftists manipulable. Rightists are notorious liars.

I’ve heard people say that the people who didn’t vote should count as people who voted for Trump because they “let this happen” but still will say that not voting somehow is a baller left tactic.

You’re conflating the opinions of two diametrically opposed camps of people.

And more importantly, why are you promoting the idea that the right wants?

The right wants us to fuck off and die. How that gets achieved is subject to debate within their circles. The right most certainly does not want us to give them the wall. The right most certainly does not want us to develop dual power, take direct action to right the wrongs of capitalism, do mutual aid and community defense, and generally live outside their imposed norms and morality. If the right wing of capital has to lose at all, they would rather lose to the left wing of capital, for a simple reason: they understand that losing to the left wing of capital is neither permanent nor substantiative.