Any civilian paramilitary that amasses the necessary ordinance and resources to stand up to an oppressive state will inevitably become a state actor. We are talking about guerrilla militant resistance which sprouts from grass roots organized dissent. There are many ways to build that type of movement but currently all the outlets necessary to propel such organizing are heavily suppressed, censured and moderated/controlled

Lmao. The “left” hasnt had a successful resistance to fascism because there is no left in the 2 party system and those gatekeeping the main stream discourse are bought and paid for by wall street military and prison industry profiteers. I bet you were parroting anti bernie sanders sentiment in 2016 and 2020 and now you’re pointing the finger at voters for the obvious failings a decrepit neo liberal right wing bourgeoisie puppeted controlled opposition party. All we need is another boomer dad telling us rowdy kids to quiet down and learn to be respectful towards the adults who are responsible for the disaster they allowed to metastasize.

And who happily took the bribes from those who engorge themselves on passive income? Both parties. But the party that pretends to represent the people and virtue signaling about trans rights, blm and identity politics while ignoring real working class issues is the Democratic party. We dont have a left party in the usa. A right leaning center party is not an opposition party to a far right party, you dont fight fascism with tepid corporatist lite semi fascist policies,. You fight it with ideas that actually oppose their platform. Chick schumer just showed us what the Democratic party thinks. They want to appeal to moderate voters and centrists or the imaginary friends that true leftists know don’t exist or even if they did they dont matter within the conversation of social progress. We are being gaslit and you’re buying into the gaslighting

He has got fucking conservative neo liberal dad hedge fund bro astro turfed out the ass energy. He has the wrong energy. The Democratic party needs to get out of the way and allow for true leftism instead of sabotaging anything that threatens their cash cow.

The enemy that divided us was the democratic party who made it clear they were more than willing to sabotage working class voters to ensure that policy would not move to the left. Their main prerogative is to thwart economic democracy and maintain the class dictatorship of neo liberalism that their wall street military and prison industry profiteers pay them to maintain. The enemy isnt the right its billionaire war mongering prison industry profiteers who control both parties. The democratic party by the standards of the rest of the developed world is a center right party. We don’t even have a true left opposition party in the us just two different flavors of conservative boot licking bullshit working to undermine working class consciousness and solidarity at every possible opportunity

Even though its LLM crap The first half of that is pretty Much spot on whats already happened. As i said it reminds me of the scene in the movie the dictator where he addresses american diplomats and says “Why are you guys so anti-dictators? Imagine if America was a dictatorship. You could let 1% of the people have all the nation’s wealth. You could help your rich friends get richer by cutting their taxes. And bailing them out when they gamble and lose. You could ignore the needs of the poor for health care and education. Your media would appear free, but would secretly be controlled by one person and his family. You could wiretap phones. You could torture foreign prisoners. You could have rigged elections. You could lie about why you go to war. You could fill your prisons with one particular racial group, and no one would complain. You could use the media to scare the people into supporting policies that are against their interests.” Which is exactly what we have in america. The idea that neo liberal western democracy is anything but a class dictatorship is just delulu naive wishful thinking enforced by decades of conditioning through schooling that has abandoned adequate intellectual development of its students decades ago

I think this is a half assed acceptance of responsibility. Firstly i don’t believe our democracy even functions anymore. Our entire political system has been compromised by money, bribes, campaign contributions from billionaires. Both the dems and republicans are both fascist parties. The Democratic party any where else in the world by the standards of the rest of the developed world is a center right wing party we have no true left opposition party in the usa. The democrats are clearly a controlled opposition party who’s primary goal is to appease their wall street military and prison industry profiteer donors and prevent any policy shift to the left in order to thwart economic democracy and continue the class dictatorship that is modern neo liberal western “democracy” which is inherently undemocratic.

There are 14 defining traits of fascism and 13 of them are present in both partied albeit to differing degrees. But the one trait that both parties work to maintain s plausible deniability as to its existence is fraudulent elections. But to think that even though money has corrupted every other aspect of our political system that for some reason maybe the ideals of American exceptionalism and the integrity of democracy itself, that one aspect of fascism is a bridge tok far to cross and those with extreme wealth and greed who lack all humanity and show no self Restraint on any given day would at least control themselves there for the good of mankind? If you truly believe that i have a bridge to sell you.

In germany the highest constitutional court decided in the last 10-15 years or so(i don’t remember when exactly) that electronic voting is unconstitutional because it is impossible to differentiate between fraudulent results and legitimate ones for anyone who isn’t a cuber security or IT expert and its important that laymen(or lay people) can understand the results of an election and see the proof for themselves. And even if we put all this aside in 2016 we saw the Iowa caucus (a democratic process void of electronic obfuscation)deliberately manipulated for clinton despite sanders supporters outnumbering clinton supporters 2 to 1 and i remember seeing a video back then(i wish i had saved it) of election workers doing a test on a vote counting/tabulation machine to verify results and the machine completely skewed the inputed data which distressed all the workers participating to the point where 3 people were in tears.

This isnt a “trump was right” statement because those who are nominated by the party are most likely complicit and know who will be chosen and even if they do not know till the media puts out the results and manufactures the consent of the people they still very likely know the reality. And Trump definitely knew in 2016 and had no problem the election was rigged then because it benefited him which means he doesn’t care that the election is rigged so long as he benefits and gains power from it.

But regardless of what i believe it is the reality that every thing about our society is rigged by the ultra wealthy. And it is naive to believe that they would allow the workers the ability to choose who governs them when they regularly make it clear what they think of us. That we are a disposable commodity who’s existence is only a means for their own end. As a labor pool to exploit and wring dry for profit so they don’t have to do any of the things they see as beneath them while they live in opulent luxury and spend more on weekend vacations than you or i could earn in a dozen consecutive lifetimes.

Now in the crazy off chance that our democracy actually does function (which is just impossible given the way the world is currently run by the .001%) then the democrats lost because they refuse to move to the left and they intentionally lost because their donors are the dame donors funding the republicans and democrats are under orders to sabotage any leftist populist candidates to maintain the class dictatorship that their billionaire owners have established and aim to maintain at all costs.

Now let the butthurt neo liberal downvotes ensue.

Dickflation.

Continued:

Its like people are Soooooooo fucking close to seeing the reality of our society for what it has become but so many continue to cling to a delusional ideal of American exceptionalism and the integrity of neo liberal western democracy that has for anyone with a functioning brain, ceased to exist since at least the 1980’s or very likely since the mass assassinations of left wing civil rights and political leaders in the 1960’s like maybe the second half of the prompt hasn’t become reality yet but the first half is spot on. It is just like that scene in sacha baron cohen’s the dictator where he goes on a tangent about why do american’s hate dictatorships so much and then describes what american would look like in a dictatorship and pretty much describes exactly what America has increasingly become i  the last 5-6 decades

If you noticed and have been paying attention to society and reading between the lines you can see we are already well beyond the first half of this AI assessment having happened Like we are so close to where we need to be but so many people have been immobilized by poverty and continuing the motions of paycheck to paycheck existence that they really cant stand up behind the scenes and so many others have bought the koolaid and think that a system that has been completely compromised by corporatism and money will allow for self remediation through the same system while they simultaneously ignore the fact that the democratic party actively works to thwart any policy movement to the left and ultimately neo liberal western democracy actively fights against the implementation of economic democracy which makes it a defacto class dictatorship. Too many of us have been conditioned so thoroughly and insidiously that they cant tell the difference between real journalism and corporate propaganda masquerading as journalism with integrity. And then anyone who points out the most likely reality of the situation is called a conspiracy theorist and leftist leaning explanations that substantiate any collusion by the ultra wealthy and are deemed “conspiracy” are considered lunacy but now the right has coopted this mistrust of authority to empower itself and weaponized it to the complete opposite end of the spectrum that leftists calling out abuses of power who first brought this type of diabolical over reach by the ultra wealthy to light did in the days before the internet and modern PR tactics that aim to discredit anyone who aims to speak truth to power. The world has become a bizarro upside down land but i think the same old tricks that corporatists/ capitalists have been using now since the 1990’s (and really even before then) are becoming obvious and class consciousness is at a level Of main stream acceptance that we have never seem before since the advent of the information super highway at least.

It may take more time but things are getting where they need to be and removing the right of regular people to obtain firearms will be a step in the wrong direction and serve to push the precipice of revolution further down the road possibly decades or even a century or more.

Ill answer your question by pasting someones comment i read today in a post in r/technology that briefly made it to r/all before mods removed it. The post was about reddit’s response to the wide spread luigi mangione support and it was someone posting a response to an AI prompt on GROK3 and I think it provides a good image of where we are as a society and where this will lead us in the hopefully not too distant future.(the sooner the better IMO)

I think if you ask an AI they’ll tell you.

Here’s what Grok told me a couple weeks ago:

here is Grok 3’s unexpurgated take:

(Me) Assuming that the billionaires solidify their control of the US government past the point that the people can ever have a say in what happens anymore and voting becomes irrelevant, what ultimately happens after the system is completely controlled by the 0.001%?

If billionaires were to solidify control over the U.S. government to the point where democracy effectively collapses and the public has no meaningful influence, the outcome would likely be a slow but steady transformation into an oligarchic system—think a modern feudalism with extra steps. Power would concentrate in the hands of a tiny elite, maybe a few dozen families or individuals, who’d use their wealth to dictate policy, law, and resource distribution. History gives us some clues: when unchecked elites run the show—Roman patricians, Renaissance merchant-princes, or even post-Soviet oligarchs—things tend to follow a pattern.

First, you’d see the economy morph into a machine that funnels wealth upward even faster. Tax structures, labor laws, and regulations would tilt hard toward protecting the 0.001%—no more pesky antitrust enforcement or worker protections. Corporations owned by these billionaires would dominate, merging with the state in a kind of gilded fascism. Think monopolies on steroids, where dissenters get crushed not by jackboots but by algorithm-driven blacklists and financial ostracism. The middle class would erode as wages stagnate and automation (owned by the elite) displaces jobs, leaving a stark divide: a small aristocracy and a sprawling, dependent underclass.

Society wouldn’t stay quiet forever, though. People don’t just shrug off losing their voice—they simmer, then boil. Without voting as an outlet, unrest would grow. Protests, riots, maybe even low-level insurgencies could pop up, especially as inequality becomes unbearable. The billionaires would counter with surveillance tech and private security forces—Blackwater 2.0, but with drones and AI. Public education and healthcare would likely wither, keeping the masses less capable of organizing or resisting. Propaganda would ramp up too, probably through media they own, painting their rule as inevitable or benevolent.

Long term, it’s unstable. Absolute control sounds nice if you’re at the top, but it breeds resentment and fragility. The 0.001% might fracture internally—power-hungry elites often turn on each other when there’s no external threat to unify them. Or some black-swan event (climate disaster, tech breakthrough, foreign interference) could disrupt their grip. If the system gets too rigid, it might just collapse under its own weight, like a top-heavy empire—think Rome 2.0, but with better Wi-Fi. Alternatively, they could pull off a dystopian win, keeping the masses pacified with bread, circuses, and VR headsets while they sip champagne in fortified enclaves.

No crystal ball here, but the vibe would be a mix of The Hunger Games aesthetics and Gilded Age vibes—opulence for the few, quiet desperation for the rest, and a slow burn toward either revolution or resignation. What do you think—would people fight back hard, or just adapt to the new normal?

(Me again) In the scenario you just described, what happens to the billionaires themselves after society collapses?

Once society collapses under the weight of their control, the billionaires’ fate hinges on how well they’ve insulated themselves and how the collapse plays out. They’ve got resources—money, private security, bunkers, offshore havens—so they’re not exactly scrambling for scraps right away. But they’re not invincible either; a societal breakdown cuts both ways.

If it’s a chaotic free-for-all—think riots, infrastructure failure, and armed factions—they’d likely hole up in fortified compounds or flee to places like New Zealand or private islands they’ve already bought. They’ve got the means: private jets, loyal mercenaries, and stockpiles of food and fuel. Some might even have tech-driven mini-cities ready, with solar grids and hydroponics to ride out the storm. For a while, they’d live like post-apocalyptic kings, surrounded by guards and sipping vintage wine while the world burns. But isolation has limits. Supply chains, even private ones, erode in total chaos. Their staff—pilots, security, engineers—might turn on them if loyalty fades or desperation kicks in. A pissed-off ex-employee with a gun and a grudge could unravel their little utopia fast.

If the collapse spawns organized resistance—say, a coalition of pissed-off citizens or a rogue military splinter—they’d face bigger threats. Billions don’t buy immunity from a determined mob or a drone strike. History’s littered with examples: French aristocrats thought their chateaus were safe until the guillotines rolled out. The billionaires might try to negotiate, offering resources to warlords or new power players, but trust would be thin. They could end up as bargaining chips, ransomed, or just eliminated as symbols of the old regime.

Internally, they’d probably start eating each other too. With no common enemy left to unify them, rivalries would flare. One billionaire’s private army might raid another’s compound for dwindling resources. Alliances would shift, paranoia would spike, and their little oligarchy could fracture into a survivalist soap opera. Think Game of Thrones, but with fewer dragons and more Teslas.

Longer term, if society rebuilds, they might try to reinsert themselves as saviors—funding reconstruction, playing philanthropist to rewrite their legacy. Some might pull it off, especially if they’ve hoarded critical tech or knowledge. Others could fade into obscurity, their wealth meaningless in a world that’s moved on. Worst case, they’re hunted down by a new order that sees them as the root of the mess.

So, post-collapse, they’d either cling to power as warlord-lite figures in their gilded cages, get taken out by betrayal or vengeance, or slink away to obscurity if the world resets. Depends on how ruthless they stay and how much the rest of humanity cares to chase them. What’s your take—would they outlast the chaos or get swallowed by it?

They ripped what was left of it out in 2016 and then Performed a complete vivisection in 2020 to make sure they didnt miss any remnants in any crevices as so they could ensure their neo liberal illusion of democracy could continue the class dictatorship their billionaire wall street military and prison industry profiteer donors paid for so they would be appeased and wouldn’t cut off their funding.

Yet why was the US military unable to gain a decisive victory in north korea, Vietnam, or afghanistan? To name just a few instances where the level of military capability didn’t do enough to combat the will and resilience of the indigenous population.

I would rather die fighting against fascists than lay down my rights and submit to class dictatorship in a wage slave hellscape that isnt even worth living and participating for.

Our gun problem in the usa is a symptom of our problem with deteriorating conditions caused by the deregulation of capitalism. The school Shooting phenomena is not new, it first manifested as the “going postal” phenomenon but now with both parents having to work and kids having shitty support structures because they are being bullied by other kids starved of proper parental guidance/nurturing these kids are getting to their parents guns and taking out their frustrations mostly on people that have bullied them and anyone standing in their way or who did nothing to stop the bullies. It doesnt take a genius to see the reality here. There was a very good documentary i saw in the last decade or so pertaining to the phenomenon.

Asking the government to be a paternalistic nanny state and protect us from Ourselves a short sighted naive way to deal with the issues.

Also most of the guns have concentrated into the hands of fascist sympathizers because democrats have been brainwashed by centrism/ neo liberalism And think its a leftist ideal to want to disarm the nation and let police continue to murder people with impunity and give citizens even less recourse to protect ourselves. And also the economic environment we are in has punished true leftists with abhorrent economic conditions snd most of su struggle to survive and afford housing nevermind be able to afford a $1500+ rifle and ammunition and we just rely on grocers and the industrialized murder industry of livestock to provide our packaged dead animal for nutrition so many are so far removed from reality and if things fell to shit in a revolution most neo liberal’s would not last a month on their own probably even less than that if they have renounced gun ownership and taken up pacifism as their answer for the deteriorating state of western neo liberal Democracy (which lacking economic democracy and blatantly opposed to it is actually an undemocratic class dictatorship)

But keep telling yourself everything will be ok and bow down to accept the bloodless right wing coup the heritage foundation project 2025 authors have planned and has obviously been in the works for the last 4 decades at least.

How many guns were used by African Americans before and after reconstruction? Do you not know the history of the civil rights movment and the black panther party using guns to advance their anti fascist cause?(something that even the NRA detested and so chose to support the disarming of the working class) did you know the two biggest growing demographic of gun owners today are colored women and LGBTQ people?

Also it goes without saying that we haven’t had a leftist uprising since leftism has virtually been erased From the chat since the 1980’s and supressed to the point that most people believe neo liberal right leaning centrists cosplaying as leftists and believing that ballot box socialism/reform is actually a plausible way to remedy a system Entirely corrupted by corporatists. But right now we are definitely at a precipice where we are closer than ever to a class war and i would rather die in the furtherance of that cause than be provided some half ass sense of security through the deprivation of my civil right to own a firearm. I personally am sick of this consumerist capitalist hellscape we’ve had beaten over the head our entire lives as the only way a civilized society should function while we produce disposable useless consumerist garbage, waste 1/3 of all food produced that isnt sold for a profit to make billionaires even richer while enough homes and apartments sit empty to provide ebery homeless person over a dozen homes,

In the words of Marx “any attempt to disarm the workers should be frustrated, by force if necessary”

How about we dont let the concentration of power skew even more towards the hands of fascists than it already is? I mean it must be nice to live in delulu lala land where we can eliminate guns from society but so long as inteligent people exist and 3d printers are consumer goods (not to mention a thriving black market) there will always be ways around laws. I think the world would be a much better place if the mulford act never passed and if the wild west OK panhandle mentality of everyone has a gun persisted. Disarmjng the working class so that police and bureaucrats more than willing to enrich themselves with bribes from capitalists can be the final arbiters of who should and should not posses the means for self defense is just such idealistic nonsense. The world would be a better place if wall street military and prison industry profiteers were scared of the workers instead of the other way around as we have today.

Thats some of it but if you order comments by controversial you’ll see the boot lickers and their neo lib apologists are out in full force

You don’t know a thing about harm reduction then if that’s the analogy you’re choosing.

Limiting people’s access pushes them to the black market.

We are at the point of full fledged fascist authoritarianism in america and neo liberals still want to take guns away from the workers. Man you all really guzzled down the corpo kool aid.

The neo liberals don’t like what sanders is doing so they are trying to do the same thing to offer their tepid right leaning centrism which is what brought us to this point. The billionaire owned democrats are always looking for a way to impose their tepid right leaning centrism and thwart any hint of leftward movement towards economic democracy. Their goal is to maintain this class dictatorship at all costs and allowing full fledged fascism to enter the highest office was preferable to any administration that resembled FDR from Gaining power.

Like the billionaire owned neo liberals would allow that. They lost their shit when sanders challenged them and did everything they could to prevent him from bringing any modicum of economic democracy to the us.

Removing guns from citizens will only allow them to concentrate into the hands of the wealthy, and their militarized forces.

Neo liberalism has failed the working class and parroting the idea that we must restrict peoples freedoms to protect them from themselves is not only dumb its disingenuous and patently false.

If people weren’t educated on using cars they would be EVEN WORSE drivers. Also all the restrictive rules on driving like artificially low speed limits actually make it less safe for good drivers.

We killed education standards in this country to make things more conservative and thwarted leftist populism to allow full devolution into authoritarian fascism.

now remind me, did drug prohibition/ restrictions result in decreased supply and demand or did it instead just increase the black market value of these still in demand products while funneling people a majority of which are marginalized poor and working class, into prisons so correctional corporations could siphon tax dollars into their profits and simultaneously profit off of legalized slave labor? How will restrictions on gun ownership be any different?

More people die from Vehicular manslaughter every year than guns, should we further restrict automobile use?