Would you look at that, you actually can hold the bourgeoise accountable for their crimes, what a world!
I’m still not entirely sure how I feel about the death penalty in general, but if it has to exist, this is how you do it.
In China, it’s almost always commuted to life in prison. It’s like they want to given the highest sentencing they can, but not actually implement death penalty except in rare cases.
Kinda lets them pick and choose this way. Useful if your intelligence services know something that you don’t want in public.
plus you never know, maybe you’ll be the one who gets executed, so do you really wanna roll those dice?
I don’t think it’s ever ethical to kill someone that you have the power to imprison instead, but yeah China does handle it about as well as you could if you did insist on keeping the practice.
I dont agree with this approach. I believe that as the world, especially the third world, progresses towards socialism, there will be massive reactionary movements taking place. And many of these reactionaries will be extremely harmful to the general societal progress and well-being, trying to forment hatred and overthrow the government. And its a practical guarantee tha Western interests will try to leverage these reactionary movements
In such cases, especially for poorer countries, imprisonment for life is wasting of societal resources that should’ve gone to the working class rather than the parasites who actively tried to harm the workers by betraying the proletariat class.
In fact, keeping them alive adds more fuel to the reactionary movements instead of cutting the head of the serpent.
I’ve seen this far too often, where reactionaries will have no moral code, and the revolutionary sentiments will fall flat because “we can’t protect our class interests, or we will be just like them” so the reactionaries always win
In such cases, especially for poorer countries, imprisonment for life is wasting of societal resources that should’ve gone to the working class rather than the parasites who actively tried to harm the workers by betraying the proletariat class.
I don’t give a fuck about “wasting resources” the world I wish to create will have such an absurd abundance of resources that the concept of waste will be obsolete.
We already live in a world with that amount of resources, they’re just all controlled by the ruling class.
Thats admirable but unfortunately, the real world still does have scarcity of resources. Especially in poorer countries. One day, I’m sure we’ll all reach a post abundance state. But until then, I fully support the proletarian of my country and countries like my own delivering capital punishment on major reactionaries and parasites.
I’m not accusing you of anything, but can I ask you to reconsider some of your reasoning? The resource expenditure savings argument is also used by eugenicists when they advocate for the killing of the disabled or “undesirable”. Therefore, I would like to suggest that is wrongheaded to lend credence to this idea.
The basis of the argument isn’t very sound since it doesn’t actually take that much to provide for an individuals basicmost needs, especially if they are an inmate within a preexisting prison infrastructure. Only in the most extreme of circumstances, such as in the event of a major disaster, could the provision of that person’s needs require depriving someone else of theirs.
Using lethal force against reactionaries has its merits, and you have pointed some of them out earlier. Saving resources, however, is not a particularly valid one and I would like to gently suggest that you reconsider that point.
Dit also isnt really true I the American system, in most cases the cost of executing the death penalty is higher than life imprisonment because the legal process is so drawn out. I guess the further argument is that you could expedite the process and risk false convictions, but isnt that already happening too much anyway?
“expedite the process and risk false convictions”
Yes, and according to the Death Penalty Project roughly 1/8th of executed persons are wrongly convicted. Expediting the process would only increase this number. However this is also a side effect of the way the criminal trials in US penal system work. Postrevolutionary purging of reactionary elements would likely be different. The question of “should we kill the guy who ran a death camp?” Is not the same as “Should we kill or imprison an 18 year old for shooting someone in a robbery gone wrong?”
(The answer to the second one is imprisonment but under a more rehabilitative, restorative justice model btw)
Honestly, I don’t really agree with this line of logic, these same people would be more than willing to kill thousands if it meant they could pad out there own wallets so they should be fucking shot.
Same thing goes to other traitors and reactionaries, I’m not exactly going to lose sleep over an SS officer getting shot and so should you (because they deserve it)
these same people would be more than willing to kill thousands if it meant they could pad out there own wallets so they should be fucking shot.
This is just a revenge fantasy, it is completely illogical.
2-year reprieve
That sounds strange to me. I guess it’s a literal translation thing. To check: does it mean he goes to jail for 2 years and then gets executed?
From true anon:
These always seem to have “reprieve” on them, I assume that means the sentence is downgraded based on some kind of good behavior after the time specified, could someone tell me if this assumption is correct?
Yes. "Reprieve” in China’s context means that they will be monitored for X years, as demanded by the court. If the inmate did not withheld any criminal information and did not commit new crimes during this period, the sentence is automatically commuted to life imprisonment (paroles are possible for exceptionally good behavior).
I think that it’s a good system: it clearly punishes criminals and anti-communist elements while still offering a chance for redemption and avoiding wrongful executions.
Ah yes, life in prison, also known as redemption. In all seriousness though, comparing reality, I’d rather have that than what we do in America (hand them the keys to all of the kingdom). Theres gotta be a way to set this bitch up where rich people straight up don’t exist tho. Gotta be.
Developing the productive forces. Takes a long time and rich people will exist while you do it, but at some point you reach communism.
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Theres definitely a way. If Earth is a collection of systems, and systems can be mathematically mapped, theres a way to distribute resources in a way that does not end up with inequality. Maybe its not practically possible, but defining it first would get us closer to the truth.
Part of the Marxist Leninist approach to political economy is that markets are actually good signals. Even if those signals are the actions that the bourgeois take.
You do have to go through some slog to gather data on how the market actually functions. The NEP was short lived and revealed a lot to the USSR, and China has the Special Economic Zones that exist to gather data on how the global market works.
The isolationist states have everything pretty well figured out, but they’re excluded from the collective labor of the international proletariat. It’s important to remain connected to the global economy in some way so you can understand exactly how the international proletariat is being exploited.
That doesn’t really answer the question of materially providing for everyone, it is only part of the picture. I’m sure the answer will simply be, the railways aren’t simply for moving people around in the end. I’ve noticed a lot of the “developed” world has production down, but waste is as abundant as the products. Now that I’ve been talking to the bears for about a year, I should look more into how China is doing on the “providing for everyone” front and try to find eastern sources. I’m sure theres political nerds who have done the leg work on the whole world no matter how the state is run. I’d like to see that too.
That doesn’t really answer the question of materially providing for everyone
the railways aren’t simply for moving people around in the end
I think you may be misidentifying the problem. Distribution logistics are not the problem. We already have both the resources and the means to distribute those resources such that everyone on the planet has more than enough to live a fulfilling life free from fear of starvation or any other unmet basic need. We also have the ability to deal with the resulting waste which is trivial in comparison to the real roadblock in the way of worldwide universal post-scarcity.
The real problem is political. The real problem is the prevention of the sequestration and hoarding of wealth and resources. The hoarding of wealth and resources also creates the conditions for concentrations of power, power that is used to maintain and enforce the system in its inequitable state. That is what has to be overcome. And socialist countries (countries in transition and led by a communist party) have overcome that to a significant degree, but it can never be complete so long as so much power is concentrated in the hands of those whose interest lies in maintaining the global system already in place, a system based on exploitation (i.e. imperialism and unequal exchange abroad and capitalism domestically). That is what we are up against as people who want to bring about worldwide post-scarcity equity, we are not up against a mere failure to map out the most efficient distribution networks, because that latter problem, despite what you’ve been told, is already solved.
Nothing is perfect, but we do have the systems to properly manage and allocate resources now.
The real value of the internet and computers is the ability to break through the barriers that limited the old revolutions. Administration can be automated in a way that liberates is from a managerial class and a large amount of labor (assuming that production is done on an as needed basis).
The Soviets knew this, and the West knows this. It’s why the systems backing modern LLMs can draw a direct line from Gosplan production matrix planning through Stafford Beer and Cybersyn.
Those systems were coopted by western financial corporations to create the modern stock trading markets and algorithms, and they’re incredibly effective since they are able to drive production through allocation of capital.
yeah i don’t get why they don’t tax these guys more. liberals throw around ideas like 100% tax after 999 million, it shouldn’t be that hard to make a functional policy with continuously increasing marginal tax
Not sure, but I think part of it was they also had to pay back the money or something along those lines.
he gets killed and then resurrected temporarily
Juche necromancy doing things the Western mind can’t even begin to comprehend
i actually need this. bring me back when we doing world revolution
sentenced to death
with a 2-year reprieve
Wish it was for prostituition rings in south east Asia as well but beggers can’t be choosers so any chance to wipe off another parasite is good.
